How long before

[SwissSculler]

For perspective, does anyone have any stats of what % of people are Trans and athletes? In other words how many college age athletes are trans potentially? I am wondering what kind of actual numbers we are talking about.

[Slim]

For perspective, does anyone have any stats of what % of people are Trans and athletes? In other words how many college age athletes are trans potentially? I am wondering what kind of actual numbers we are talking about.

I found a well cited study from 2017 estimating the number of trans folks at 390 per 100,000 in the US. In Utah the governor vetoed the anti trans bill in part because there was only one trans girl competing in HS sport in the state.

[okayrower]

The NCAA has moved all decisions on this issue to each sport’s national governing body, so women’s collegiate rowing falls under the USRowing policy.

The USRowing policy is that athletes can compete in the category they identify without having to take any drugs. (Athletes who are looking to compete at international events would need to follow the worldrowing guidelines.)

[Mandolorian]

The NCAA has moved all decisions on this issue to each sport’s national governing body, so women’s collegiate rowing falls under the USRowing policy.

The USRowing policy is that athletes can compete in the category they identify without having to take any drugs. (Athletes who are looking to compete at international events would need to follow the worldrowing guidelines.)

So are you saying that if 8 guys do absolutely nothing (no drugs, no gender testing, etc..) and simply say they identify as females, they could race at the Women's' NCAA Championships?

[Prettyinfiveseat]

The NCAA has moved all decisions on this issue to each sport’s national governing body, so women’s collegiate rowing falls under the USRowing policy.

The USRowing policy is that athletes can compete in the category they identify without having to take any drugs. (Athletes who are looking to compete at international events would need to follow the worldrowing guidelines.)

If this is true I can see some coaches running all over their campus handing out scholarships to men identifying as women

[okayrower]

The NCAA has moved all decisions on this issue to each sport’s national governing body, so women’s collegiate rowing falls under the USRowing policy.

The USRowing policy is that athletes can compete in the category they identify without having to take any drugs. (Athletes who are looking to compete at international events would need to follow the worldrowing guidelines.)

So are you saying that if 8 guys do absolutely nothing (no drugs, no gender testing, etc..) and simply say they identify as females, they could race at the Women's' NCAA Championships?

As long as I’m reading it correctly, the USRowing policy look pretty straight forward. The athlete notifies member services the athlete would like to have gender match that which the athlete identifies. All that would be needed is a written is a statement, and USRowing responds within seven days. The member club is notified with another three days.

Pages 9 through 10:
https://s3.amazonaws.com/sidearm.sites/ ... 112020.pdf

[rowing]

Just found the next lawsuit money pit for USRowing.

I figure six cases should finish them off for good.

[crewu]

Just found the next lawsuit money pit for USRowing.

I figure six cases should finish them off for good.

Ten years ago maybe. Times have changed. I think more likely in this current climate that we won't be hearing much more criticism of trans athletes. It will be sold as "settled science". Social media will remove any criticisms as hate speech, complainers will be demonized and shut down as be transphobic - we've seen that already on this thread. Sponsors will cut off any athlete that complains about unfairness. Networks won't want the backlash and will stay away from the issue, other than to create made for TV stories about how brave these trans athletes are to play women's sports.

And USRowing will most likely sanction any rower or club severely for unsportsmanlike conduct if they were to publicly raise the issue about a specific trans athlete. I guess a sanction would be the most likely move that would spark a lawsuit against USRowing so we might circle back to you being correct after all.

[rowing]

Just found the next lawsuit money pit for USRowing.

I figure six cases should finish them off for good.

Ten years ago maybe. Times have changed. I think more likely in this current climate that we won't be hearing much more criticism of trans athletes. It will be sold as "settled science". Social media will remove any criticisms as hate speech, complainers will be demonized and shut down as be transphobic - we've seen that already on this thread. Sponsors will cut off any athlete that complains about unfairness. Networks won't want the backlash and will stay away from the issue, other than to create made for TV stories about how brave these trans athletes are to play women's sports.

And USRowing will most likely sanction any rower or club severely for unsportsmanlike conduct if they were to publicly raise the issue about a specific trans athlete. I guess a sanction would be the most likely move that would spark a lawsuit against USRowing so we might circle back to you being correct after all.

Lawsuits can be filed under seal.

USRowing can't flush a toilet without mistakes, so we know that eventually it's going to happen. All it takes is a few Florida or Texas parents with a little money from some conservative pockets, an ambitious lawyer, free time, and a desire to be a thorn. Geewillickers-----what are the odds of finding some of those?

Rowing would be an excellent test case, as there is little attention paid, and the gates are wholly unguarded. You won't see any celebs coming to the rescue.

USRowing's only preventative chance is to cut and paste the appropriate language from swimming or track rules. If not, they can change that logo to a giant puckering star.

[singlesculler]

I'm surprised we haven't heard more about the track athlete Caster Semenya. Anything more recent then this 2021 article?
https://www.npr.org/sections/tokyo-olym ... e-olympics

Semenya, 30, was raised female, identifies as female and is legally female.

The debate hinges on this question: Should women athletes with what's called a difference of sexual development (DSD) — who have XY chromosomes and elevated testosterone levels — be allowed to compete in the female category?
Or does their genetic makeup give intersex athletes an unfair advantage in a world of sport that's divided along binary lines of sex?

Comes back to the question, will there be a legal definition of "Biological Women"? Chromosomes, gene expression, hormone levels, secondary sex characteristics, outward appearance when naked . . . . .

On the far extreme, they may require you to becoming pregnant and give birth to a viable baby to prove you are, in their definition, a true "biological women" .

[socalstroke]

No need to conflate intersex and trans. They are distinct cohorts. I would also be careful citing DSD's as some would not be considered useful by clinicians in this debate and new research has pushed back on others.

[yeahbuddy]

No need to conflate intersex and trans. They are distinct cohorts.

If there are endocrine parameters in place, both are going to intersect. Banning natural and rewarding unnatural is a logic dead end. It turns a compelling discussion into a farce, a cheap vehicle for the shallow-but-predictable conclusion that anyone who disagrees Is a hateful trans misogynist.

[andpaddle]

The NCAA has moved all decisions on this issue to each sport’s national governing body, so women’s collegiate rowing falls under the USRowing policy.

The USRowing policy is that athletes can compete in the category they identify without having to take any drugs. (Athletes who are looking to compete at international events would need to follow the worldrowing guidelines.)

So are you saying that if 8 guys do absolutely nothing (no drugs, no gender testing, etc..) and simply say they identify as females, they could race at the Women's' NCAA Championships?

I hate to even wade into such a toxic thread, but this reflects such a bad-faith argument. I know you’re just saying it theoretically could happen under those rules, but saying “look what could happen!” is used constantly to attack trans people who very much so aren’t doing that.

There’s this bugaboo out there that men will just say they’re trans to compete with women to win something and as far as I can tell, it has never happened, because it’s abundantly clear that without the life changes of actually living as a trans person, no one would respect the athletic success (or likely allow it). In every high profile trans athlete scenario in the news, they’ve been people who have changed their entire lives, usually living as women (with somewhat irreversible hormonal treatment), and faced the *giant* amounts of social opprobrium that entails. Until someone actually tries this, it’s just a strawman - and frankly, the only bad behavior in your hypothetical is by cis men.

[rowing]

That is not a viable argument for a lack of a coherent and consistent policy built on the best science for each sport.

USA Swimming has thrown down a good start. The NCAA is either going to do what it said and adopt it as their own swimming rule, or they will cave like cowards whose words mean nothing.

USRowing may not find the swimming rules appropriate, but feelz ain't a metric either.

Get your sh!t together, USRowing, and start codifying the logic....before DEI becomes DIE.